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Dont worry we can fight the Chinese, North Koreans, Moose Limbs and Russians with armies of Green Workers carrying windmill blades and solar panels.

Obamas stimulus package appeasing our enemies IMPEACH BARACK OBAMA

Obama IS the Manchurian Candidate.

Wow... I am amazed you can hear me all the way back there in the 50's!

These newfangled 'cars' really messed up the horse industry. And of course these 'interwebs' totally screwed up the printing-press industry.

Someday you will embrace the fact that industry CHANGES. Building relics from the cold war era serves no useful purpose. Whereas green technology is clearly the future of the industrial economy. Which will create... NEW jobs. People like this blog owner would have us building a bridge to the past, and let India and China whoop our collective @sses for the next several decades. Good thinking! Nothing ever changes, and if it was useful in the dark ages it must still be useful today!

Your right beerbooger those missles that china,n korea and iran fire are just toys,those countries don't mean us any harm, do they?

Too bad Spains Green Jobs initiative resulted in losing 2 jobs for every Green Job created resulting in unemployment approaching 18%.

And people in the 50s bought cars because they wanted them. NOT because the government forced them do.

To Anonymous,

The reason why you can be heard so well in the 50's is because that is where your thinking lives. Back then, we did not need missile defense. Instead, we relied upon the concept of Mutually Assured Destruction (MAD) to keep the USA and USSR from starting WW III. Interceptors were considered to be destablizing back then, because they might give one side the hope of surviving a nuclear exhange. Basically, every US and Soviet city was on the front lines. Fortunately, that war never began.

Today, we have rogue nations, like North Korea, who have the weapons and the delivery systems designed reach the US. They are not a good delivery systems, but they do not have to be. Ground-based Midcourse Defense (GMD) is designed to take out this type of threat. That threat is not meant to overwelm us (as in the cold war) but terrorize us. Our ability to retaliate in kind may not work. Besides, would we really want to be in a position where we had to kill a million of theirs because they killed a million of ours?

To call GMD a relic from the cold war is ignorant, for the reasons that I outlined above. Yes, it grew out of the Strategic Defense Initiative (SDI), but its mission is vastly different from that envisioned over 30 years ago. The fact is that there are still bad guys in the world, and some of them have nuclear weapons. But, if you think that we have nothing to fear from Kim Jong-il, move to an Alaskan city. They are in range right now. If you don't like the cold or the politics, try Seattle. Soon the Taep'o-dong 2 (TD-2) will have the range.

Looks like they will scrap the F-22, as well. Can't remember where I read it (today) but there have been more jobs lost in America since Jan 1, than were gained in the previous 9 years. Job losses in America will begin to excellerate in number as the summer turns to fall due to the losses of summer jobs for students. Watch for there to be shortages of products, high prices, and greater unreast in the near future.

Watch for there to be shortages of products, high prices, and greater unreast in the near future.
Eric

And Obama will say it's because we aren't implementing his plans fast enough.

I just read Animal Farm again and the lying that the pigs did in the book in order to consolidate power and rule and the lying that the democrats are doing now really hit home.

The Soviets were, by and large, atheists whose religion was the State. They had no sense of an afterlife and believed that death was the end. Therefore, mutually assured destruction worked well on them.

This doesn't work quite as well on guys like the rulers of Iran, who honestly believe that dying in a nuclear war against the West will grant them an express ticket to Heaven.

You guys are responding to an idiot whose entire argument is based on a line he ripped off from 'Family Guy.'

Meanwhile, Chairman Zero slashes and burns more defense jobs. He can spend $65 Billion bailing out his buddies in the UAW, but can't spend $1B on a top-of-the-line aircraft for our air force.

Actually Johnee it should be : they kill a million of us, they no longer exist.

Posted by: Narrator 1 at July 21, 2009 10:30 AM

Is this person confusing MAD doctrine with a missile defense system?

The F22 is useless. Demonstrably valueless, created for a mission that no longer exists against an opponent that is only found in history books. And missile defense is not working. How long have wee been trying to create anti-ballistic missiles? Having spent what, a few hundred billion dollars - and having intercepted exactly... 0 missiles... do the math with me: how does that break down on a value-per-dollar basis? are any republicans capable of rudimentary math?

I feel like the last sane man on earth... guess what would solve essentially all of our problems? (New fuel source - like... fusion). Directed energy can shoot down missiles, and that research is also FAR more valuable in the future in cross-platform applications. So.. there's a place money could be better spent when looking towards the FUTURE - hmmm, that only took 5 seconds to think up. Imagine if really smart people with FAR more information available than you do were making these decisions (oh... they are... we call him "Commander in Chief")

And guess who whines ceaselessly about things they don't understand? (Fox News readers...)

So,

Hey guys - Im starting a 'luminiferous æther' company! all alchemy all the time! (who wants to invest)! and i think the only thing that goes with that is... illuminated manuscripts!

Oh... are those industries too old to get facetime from the lunatic fringe, or will you spring to their defense, too? I can do this all day....

The leftist's argument fails because Obama is slashing defense-related R&D as well, which goes with his campaign pledge to the radical left to slash development of "future combat systems."

Even if he weren't slashing defense R&D, having weapons on the drawing board or in a laboratory really doesn't do the troops any good.

Meanwhile, while our national defense goes begging, ACORN, the UAW, the SEUI, and Geithner's buddies at Goldman Sucks get all the taxpayer money they could ever wish for.

If you'd like to read up a little, BeerBaron, go here for more information on anti-ballistic missile systems. It also summarizes missile defense fairly well, at least in generalities. As it is, you're just embarrassing yourself.

Just imagine where we'd be if we didn't have to waste time on wastes of space like you, daydreaming about fusion and directed energy (fusion? seriously? can we keep our ideas at least close to the realm of possibility?) and excluding existing, working technology. But hey, we've never had to shoot down an ICBM so clearly we should scrap the whole idea, right?

While you're brushing up on basic knowledge, read up on the F22 as well. It's really a remarkable technological achievment. But hey, someone named BeerBaron thinks it's useless. We should totally accept him as an authority on the subject.

Beerbooger the F-22 can fly circles around ANY combat jet in the world. Now with all the money China is spending on it's weapons wouldn't it make sense to stay a step ahead of them. So much for your clear analitical thinking skills.

Beerbaron you liberal dumbkoff where did you get your information from the HANOI JANE SCHOOL OF TREASON?

Also left out of the calculation of our new pet ignoramus is that weapons systems often find roles and capabilities for which they were not originally intentioned. The Predator UAV, for example, was not initially envisioned as a Hunter-Killer, but the military adapted its capabilities to meet the demands of its combat environment. F-15's were not designed for air-to-ground combat, but the modified Strike Eagle performs that role.

You never know what strategic threats lie around the corner, which is why it is important to have an array of weapons and capabilities at your disposal.

Liberals jump for joy whenever they hear that defense spending will be cut, regardless of the program.

Directed energy can shoot down missiles, and that research is also FAR more valuable in the future in cross-platform applications.
My God, beermoron has hit exactly on Project-X from Atlas Shrugged! Brilliant! Hey genius, why don't you read some Jules Verne and come up with some really stellar new ideas about weapons of the future, like ray guns and shit.

Directed energy has potential, but at the present time, that's all it has, potential. It's not combat-ready, the F-22 is.

And who is to say the Obamacrats won't stop directed energy weapons from ever reaching the field? The potential to shoot down a missile is, in the Obamacrat mind, a "destabilizing" technology because it gives the USA an advantage over our adversaries.

The research and development on the F-22 is already a sunk cost. Not to recoup that investment by investing in more production of the aircraft makes no sense. This is just like Jimmy Carter canceling the B-1; with the result being a strategic bomber force almost old enough to be eligible for social security.

I want a ray gun just like Anon said! And a particle accelerator! And two flux capacitors!

GIMME NOW OBAMA YOU'RE VERY SMART BEERBARON SAID SO!

Not to mention, the cost of maintaining F-22 production and the thousands of jobs attached to it is less than 2% of the cost of the GM/Chrysler bailout and less than 1% of the cost of the AIG bailout.

And missile defense is not working.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bw8MdEaWPU

If you honestly think that America has no military enemies in the world today that requires usage of the F22, then you're as naive as Barack Hussein Obama.

wow. lots of angst, but no actual data. (im shocked...)

Pure research is far more valuable than anything else in terms of government expenditure (is this the part where i tell you that without DARPA doing raw research, there would be no internet for the lunatic fringe to find like-minded sock puppets to talk to?)

sross-platform research is the best dollars-per-opportunity-cost outcome. An F22 does essentially nothing useful. Its electronic systems cannot work in combat areas due to interference... in fact it was nearly obsolete when it was finally rolled out (10 years late, at a comically massive overbudget price, to boot).

I also have to point out that i am exactly correct about fusion being a solution to all the world's problems - and i must also say this: THERE IS A POINT IN THE EVOLUTION OF EVERYTHING THAT WORKS, WHEN IT DID NOT WORK. Applied research on downstream benefits (rather than backward-looking ABMs or what have you) is simply a better use of human resouces.

If humanity listened to people like you, we would all still be sitting in caves, trying to decide whether or not this newfangled 'fire' thing was really worth the effort. you must be sooo proud...

The F22 is useless. Demonstrably valueless, created for a mission that no longer exists against an opponent that is only found in history books. And missile defense is not working. How long have wee been trying to create anti-ballistic missiles? Having spent what, a few hundred billion dollars - and having intercepted exactly... 0 missiles... do the math with me: how does that break down on a value-per-dollar basis? are any republicans capable of rudimentary math?
Posted by: BeerBaron at July 21, 2009 11:12 AM

This troll certainly knows how to lie through it's teeth. The Airforce "considers the F-22 a critical component for the future of US tactical airpower, and claims that the aircraft cannot be matched by any known or projected fighter." That's from the Airforce F22 Raptor Fact Sheet March 2009.

On missile defense, anti-ballistic missiles have been tested and proven to work. It isn't in the testing stage anymore. The Ground-based Midcourse Defense system is in place with anti-ballistic missiles that use kinetic warheads to take out in-coming missiles.

Ou new troll is like all trolls. It has an agenda that it isn't honest about and it lies through it's teeth.

I miss those old trolls we used to get that at least were honest about who they were and didn't pretend to be anything other than what they were.

Failure. is there anyone who can use logic to refute anything i have said? you cannot refute the DARPA point. The downstream benefits of applied research are not in dispute. and so... we boil it down to the basics: you are incapable of seeing future outcomes. "Hearing only what you want to hear, knowing only what you've heard"....

I miss those old trolls we used to get that at least were honest about who they were and didn't pretend to be anything other than what they were.

Interesting that i just happened across this linked form another blog from another... and I find people raving nonsense, try to engage some actual brainpower and see if there is any thought underlying the rantings - and you complain. "He ain't thinkin' like us! let's get im! I don't wanna do me no thinkin'! That's fer them libruls!"

are none of you embarrassed to be on the same 'side' as the likes of that?

Posted by: Anonymous at July 21, 2009 12:41 PM

Actually "anonymous," I didn't say that the troll isn't "thinkin" like us," as you put it. I showed that BeerBaron is lying through his teeth.

Which side should be embarrassed, anonymous?

there is no lie, and there are very few neurons firing in some cases here... anyone capable of more reasoned discourse? anyone?

anonoboy those things that you speak about are all fine and dandy but we are in the here and now and the Raptor and anti-missle defense do work. As far as down the line thinking that's all well and good too but why not wish for some X-wing fighters and the Death Star while you at it. By the way do you really think that with all the money obooboo is throwing around there will be any left for your futuristic ideas?

What does DARPA have to do with anything? You're comparing apples to wombats and burning strawmen left and right. Does that pass for "reasoned discourse" with you?

Seriously, fusion?

there is no lie, and there are very few neurons firing in some cases here... anyone capable of more reasoned discourse? anyone?Posted by: Anonymous at July 21, 2009 1:11 PM

The F22 is useless. Demonstrably valueless, created for a mission that no longer exists against an opponent that is only found in history books. And missile defense is not working. How long have wee been trying to create anti-ballistic missiles? Having spent what, a few hundred billion dollars - and having intercepted exactly... 0 missiles... do the math with me: how does that break down on a value-per-dollar basis? are any republicans capable of rudimentary math?

Posted by: BeerBaron at July 21, 2009 11:12 AM

Me:

This troll certainly knows how to lie through it's teeth. The Airforce "considers the F-22 a critical component for the future of US tactical airpower, and claims that the aircraft cannot be matched by any known or projected fighter." That's from the Airforce F22 Raptor Fact Sheet March 2009.

On missile defense, anti-ballistic missiles have been tested and proven to work. It isn't in the testing stage anymore. The Ground-based Midcourse Defense system is in place with anti-ballistic missiles that use kinetic warheads to take out in-coming missiles.

Troll:

there is no lie, and there are very few neurons firing in some cases here... anyone capable of more reasoned discourse? anyone?

Posted by: Too stupid to know who I am so sometimes I post as Anonymous and sometimes I post as BeerBaron at July 21, 2009 1:11 PM

Lol!!! Gee, I'm sorry you find me to have too few neurons firing and not capable of reasoned discourse, troll.

Lol!!! This is how it must be to be a Republican in Congress right now.

What does DARPA have to do with anything? You're comparing apples to wombats and burning strawmen left and right. Does that pass for "reasoned discourse" with you?

Seriously, fusion?

I am talking about the relative worth of applied research dollars versus obsolete and overbudget F22's and ABMs. There is an exact corollary between present-value dollars spent and the downstream potential of research expenditures.

So, whereas I can see how scrapping things with little immeidate value in favor of more sueful things is good... you apparently cannot see past the fact that you think the F22 is 'cool'. Or ... whatever. I feel like i am trying to teach a cat to snorkel by writing it instructions... no matter how clearly i write, these cats are never gonna snorkel...

(oh, and i can post as beerbaron again if you prefer... it is just an extra bit of typing that i find irrelevant. surely you are capable of recognizing the syntax and sentence structure of someone in possession of a classical education? i kinda stick out here...)

anonoloon aren't you getting tired of dodging all of the debate focussed your way?

there has yet to be any debate. cutting useless overbudget crap from budget good. raw research dollars good. whiny right-wing lunatic fringe bad (but only in the way forces of nature are bad.. you cant help what you are, i suppose...)

The F-22 Raptor useless?

BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA......Panting

BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA......threw up

That was the most idiotic statement I have heard from a koom bi ya dip shit troll to date.
Hey BUTT BARRON!!!!! You say that the most advanced ground attack/air to air combat jet is useless? What is your basis for that statement?

These idiots must attend the University of Casper the Wellstoned Ghost or candy Andy's community college for advanced dip shit liberal studies.

We live in a dangerous world dip shit trolls. If your glorious Messiah would identify this he could actually save his burning ass by creating jobs. It takes people and materials to make military hardware. Why cut back on our safety and jobs? That's right you lefty trolls, I am a firm believer in a military second to NONE!

Oh and BTW, Andy, the only reason you think that Michelle and I have the same IP is because you want to divert attention from yourself because this woman is whoopin' your candy ASS!!! LOL!!
Typical liberal tatctics.

So tell me, my Liberal military experts, what can be put into FIELD OPERATION by December to replace the F-22?

KHarn....if you think like a liberal, which I know you don't, they would replace it with an olive branch.

there has yet to be any debate. cutting useless over budget crap from budget good. raw research dollars good. whiny right-wing lunatic fringe bad (but only in the way forces of nature are bad.. you cant help what you are, i suppose...)

Posted by: Anonymous at July 21, 2009 2:29 PM

Debate, anonytard? Since when do you cream puffs debate. You dip shits argue like my ex-wife.
What about all you pussies crying when BOOOOOSH was in office? HUH?!

Once again I remind you all of the liberal credo...We can do it but you can't.

OH and Anonytard, please use spell check when posting. When I cut and pasted your post there was a mistake. I'm tired of cleaning up the mess you dip shit liberals leave behind.

Beerbaron,
Dont you suppose if it were possible to replace anything we currently have with all green tech, the private sector would have done so already? do you have any idea how lucrative it would be? why havent they done it then? as for missle defense, how many ICBM's have invaded our airspace? yes my mathmatician friend, exactly zero. But since you are privy to military testing and have seen their dismal failure, I guess you are in a position to lecture.

(oh, and i can post as beerbaron again if you prefer... it is just an extra bit of typing that i find irrelevant. surely you are capable of recognizing the syntax and sentence structure of someone in possession of a classical education? i kinda stick out here...)

Well, you haven't presented any facts, no figures, no real logic, or even any arguments. So, ignoring your hyperbole and asinine, baseless assertions, I'll leave you with the thought that even us drooling, knuckle-dragging neanderthals can manage to click the radio button to remember our preferred aliases.

But I do appreciate the humor you bring here. Seriously.

1. The U.S. has never had to defend against an ICBM.
2. ???
3. Scrap anti-ballistic missile defense research in favor of fusion and directed energy.

It's like whack-a-mole day here or something.

Wow... I am amazed you can hear me all the way back there in the 50's!

Actually based on your lack of knowledge so far we would rather NOT hear you at all.

These newfangled 'cars' really messed up the horse industry.

Many ranchers STILL use horses and so do quite a few police departments. This must have been sarcasm because you can't possibly be that uninformed.

And of course these 'interwebs' totally screwed up the printing-press industry.

Ok... based on this.... you really ARE that uninformed!

Someday you will embrace the fact that industry CHANGES.

There is a difference between normal "change/inovation" and FORCED at gunpoint "change" that is historicly proven to be a failure and unprofitable.

Building relics from the cold war era serves no useful purpose.

Feel free to explain why Knives, Bow's, and nets are still produced then. Each predate the BRONZE AGE and are highly effective weapons and tools that are still in use today idiot!

Whereas green technology is clearly the future of the industrial economy.

Please tell me EXACTLY which "green technology" has a 75 YEAR or longer PROVEN track record of profitability and succes as a fuel source like oh... I dunno... OIL, Coal, Whale oil, Kerosine, Wood, etc. Also just for fun which ones are the MOST sought after as products and backed PRIMARILY by private money NOT government...

Which will create... NEW jobs.

Oh... yummy!! Do privide evidence of which industries, agencies, or countries have done this so you can support THAT ridiculous claim.

People like this blog owner would have us building a bridge to the past, and let India and China whoop our collective @sses for the next several decades.

Actually that's Odumbo's STATED campaign promise. It's the position of ALL enviromentalist's, who have PREVENTED any expansion of production capacity since 1969 in Coal, Oil, Nuclear power and EVERYTHING else.

Good thinking!

Only by the uninteligent, uniformed, communist morons who think Odumbo is anything other than a lying thug who intends on finacially destroying this country.

Nothing ever changes, and if it was useful in the dark ages it must still be useful today!

I have a baseball bat net to my bed. Come over sometime and I'll show you just how useful a STONE AGE weapon can be with an attacker. Just because something is old does not reduce it's effectiveness as a fuel source or a weapon. I realize THAT is far beyond you cognitive ability but Your're new aparently so I'm trying to be kind.

One more thing.....

Yes clueless one I'm THAT SMART!!

If China and India do in fact kick our asses, it's only because they are eschewing this "green jobs" bullsh-t in favor of real jobs producing actual products.

Frankly, if green jobs really were the growth engine of the future, they wouldn't require massive unsustainable government subsidies, now would they?

Green jobs? Spain has a similar green carbon neutral plan in place as supported by cap and tax. It is cutting back on it because they discovered for every green (government subsidized) job created 2 private industry jobs were lost. China talks the green technology talk while starting up a new coal burning plant ( with no scrubbers) every few weeks in order to placate lefty environmentalists who turn a blind eye to one of the biggest carbon emmision producers on the planet. The modern environmental movement has one goal-to scale back our standard of living to aid third world nations, they don't care how much environmental damage and pain this will cause the rest of the world.

Ah, yes, well to the liberal mind, the world is beset with a number of problems, and only one solution.

Problem: Environmental pollution.
Solution: Destroy Capitalism.

Problem: Inequities in Health Care.
Solution: Destroy Capitalism.

Problem: Geo-political conflicts between cultures that have been at war for centuries.
Solution: Destroy Capitalism.

Problem: Climate change.
Solution: Destroy Capitalism.

Problem: Social inequalities.
Solution: Destroy Capitalism.

Problem: People on the radio are expressing opinions lefties don't like.
Solution: Destroy Capitalism.

Problem: Bongwater, not as tasty as promised.
Solution: Destroy capitalism.

Anonymous/Larry/Ghost/Dino: "surely you are capable of recognizing the syntax and sentence structure of someone in possession of a classical education? i kinda stick out here...)"
Y'know all of this pseudo-intellectual snobbery has become rather humdrum. Behold- a mental giant in our midst! Here to illuminate our nebulous and obfuscated views on all things in which he/she/it is more well-versed in than the rest of us- by default!

I still want an effing ray gun, please.

What clueless claims:

Oh, and i can post as beerbaron again if you prefer... it is just an extra bit of typing that i find irrelevant. surely you are capable of recognizing the syntax and sentence structure of someone in possession of a classical education? i kinda stick out here...

What clueless really means:

I could contine to identify myself but that would make it far more difficult to avoid responsibility for my idiotic statements. It really is beyond my limited mental capacity to push the right clicky on the site to be consistant but I'm a liberal so that's obviously something we fail at quite often.

Also since I am a liberal all of you should just blindly accept what I say as fact because well I'm just smarter than you bunch of retarded lesser life forms.

Oh and I almost forgot to metion how impressive my education is, how well I write, how wonderful my freinds think I am, and how impressed all of you should be because I'm gracing you with my presence and......

Woo hoo watch me toot my own tiny little horn for days about my brilliance.

What we really think of cluless:

Is this idiot for real?